The Constitution Hanging by a Thread and the “White Horse Prophecy”

The Constitution Hanging by a ThreadThere are a lot of statements on freedom and the Constitution by the Presidents of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Many of these quotes include reference to the Constitution “hanging by a thread“, the “nation… on the very verge of crumbling to pieces”, “the constitution… upon the brink of ruin” and the Elders of Israel stepping up to save the Constitution.

What also comes to mind when thinking of those statements is the “White Horse Prophecy”. This article will address the similarities, differences, and confusion surrounding the white horse prophecy and similar statements.

What is the “White Horse Prophecy”?

White Horse Prophecy - Constitution - Joseph SmithFrom the FAIR website: ” Joseph Smith is alleged to have uttered a prophecy in 1843 alluding to the four horses in the Book of Revelation (Revelation 6:1–8). This was recorded by two Church members, Edwin Rushton and Theodore Turley approximately ten years after Joseph’s death. There is no contemporary account that was recorded during the Prophet’s lifetime.”

The following is an excerpt of the journal of Elder John J. Roberts:

…While this conversation was going on we stood by his south wicket gate in a triangle. Turning to me, [Joseph] said, “I want to tell you something of the future. I will speak in a parable like unto John the Revelator. You will go to the Rocky Mountains and you will be a great and mighty people established there, which I will call the White Horse of peace and safety.” When the Prophet said, “You will see it,” I said, “Where will you be at that time?” He said, “I shall never go there. Your enemies will continue to follow you with persecutions and they will make obnoxious laws against you in Congress to destroy the White Horse, but you will have a friend or two to defend you and throw out the worst parts of the law so they will not hurt you so much. You must continue to petition Congress all the time, but they will treat you like strangers and aliens and they will not give you your rights, but will govern you with strangers and commissioners. You will see the Constitution of the United States almost destroyed. It will hang like a thread as fine as a silk fiber.” At that time the Prophet’s countenance became sad, because as he said, “I love the Constitution; it was made by the inspiration of God; and it will be preserved and saved by the efforts of the White Horse, and by the Red Horse who will combine in its defense. The White Horse will find the mountains full of minerals and they will become rich. You will see silver piled up in the streets. You will see the gold shoveled up like sand. Gold will be of little value then, even in a mercantile capacity; for the people of the world will have something else to do in seeking for salvation. The time will come when the banks of every nation will fall and only two places will be safe where people can deposit their gold and treasure. This place will be the White Horse and England’s vaults. A terrible revolution will take place in the land of America, such as has never been seen before; for the land will be left without a Supreme Government, and every specie of wickedness will be practiced rampantly in the land. Father will be against son and son against father; mother against daughter and daughter against mother. The most terrible scenes of bloodshed, murder and rape that have ever been imagined or looked upon will take place. People will be taken from the earth and there will be peace and love only in the Rocky Mountains. This will cause many hundreds of thousands of the honest in heart of the world to gather there, not because they would be Saints, but for safety and because they will be so numerous that you will be in danger of famine, but not for want of seed, time and harvest, but because of so many to be fed. Many will come with bundles under their arms to escape the calamities for there will be no escape except only by escaping and fleeing to Zion…

What Have Church Leaders Said About The White Horse Prophecy?

In General Conference, October 1918, Joseph F. Smith made the following comments:

The ridiculous story about the “red horse,” and “the black horse,” and “the white horse,” and a lot of trash that has been circulated about and printed and sent around as a great revelation given by the Prophet Joseph Smith, is a matter that was gotten up, I understand, some ten years after the death of the Prophet Joseph Smith, by two of our brethren who put together some broken sentences from the Prophet that they may have heard from time to time, and formulated this so-called revelation out of it, and it was never spoken by the prophet in the manner in which they have put it forth. It is simply false; that is all there is to it.

Elder Bruce R McConkie also commented on the “prophecy” in his book Mormon Doctrine:

From time to time, accounts of various supposed visions, revelations, and prophecies are spread forth by and among the Latter-day Saints, who should know better than to believe or spread such false information. One of these false and deceptive documents that has cropped up again and again for over a century is the so-called White Horse Prophecy. This supposed prophecy purports to be a long and detailed account by the Prophet Joseph Smith concerning the wars, turmoils, and difficulties which should exist in the last days.

In 2010 the Church released a statement on the “‘White Horse Prophecy’ and Political Neutrality“:

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is politically neutral and does not endorse or promote any candidate, party or platform. Accordingly, we hope that the campaign practices of political candidates would not suggest that their candidacy is supported by or connected to the church.

The so-called ‘White Horse Prophecy’ is based on accounts that have not been substantiated by historical research and is not embraced as Church doctrine.

What Did Joseph Smith Really Say?

Because the White Horse Prophecy has been dismissed by some Church leaders, there has been confusion from members of the Church with regard to other similar statements about the nation crumbling, the Constitution being on the brink of ruin and the Elders of Israel stepping up to save it. While the white horse prophecy may not be legitimate, there are several separate similar statements attributed to Joseph Smith.

The following is accepted as the most accurate, and verified, statement, and has been quoted by several modern prophets:

 Even this nation will be on the very verge of crumbling to pieces and tumbling to the ground, and when the Constitution is upon the brink of ruin, this people will be the staff upon which the nation shall lean, and they shall bear the Constitution away from the very verge of destruction.

(Source: Joseph Smith Collection, LDS Church Historical Department. Joseph Smith on July 19, 1840.)

There are many similar statements attributed to Joseph Smith by Brigham Young, Orson Hyde, Eliza Snow and modern prophets such as Harold B. Lee and Ezra Taft Benson (I have found at least 41 statements along these lines). I believe there is sufficient evidence to conclude that Joseph Smith truly said the nation and Constitution would be on the brink of ruin/destruction and that this people (LDS) will be involved in saving it. All we really have to do is look around us and see the fulfillment of many of those ‘prophecies’ even including some of the statements found in the alleged white horse prophecy. What we have yet to witness is the Elders of Israel stepping up to save the Constitution. Let’s hope that happens sooner rather than later, if at all. In the meantime those who are liberty-minded have a lot of educating to do as we assist the Elders of Israel in waking up to their awful situation (Ether 8) and from ignorance and complacency.

Regardless of what the future holds, there are plenty of scriptures and teachings of modern prophets that tell us we do have a responsibility to stand up for Agency, Freedom, Liberty and the Constitution.

What The Prophets Have Said About The Constitution Hanging By A Thread

Ezra Taft Benson:

Will we be prepared? Will we be among those who will “bear the Constitution away from the very verge of destruction?” If we desire to be numbered among those who will, here are some things we must do:

1. We must be righteous and moral… 2. We must learn the principles of the Constitution and then abide by its precepts… 3. We must become involved in civic affairs… 4. We must make our influence felt by our vote, our letters, and our advice…

I have faith that the Constitution will be saved as prophesied by Joseph Smith. But it will not be saved in Washington. It will be saved by the citizens of this nation who love and cherish freedom. It will be saved by enlightened members of this Church — men and women who will subscribe to and abide the principles of the Constitution. ( Source: CHB 28-31 )

For years we have heard of the role the elders could play in saving the Constitution from total destruction. But how can the elders be expected to save it if they have not studied it and are not sure if it is being destroyed or what is destroying it?…

There is no excuse that can compensate for the loss of liberty.

Satan is anxious to neutralize the inspired counsel of the Prophet and hence keep the priesthood off balance, ineffective and inert in the fight for freedom. He does this through diverse means, including the use of perverse reasoning. . . .

The cause of freedom is a most basic part of our religion. Our position on freedom helped get us to this earth and it can make the difference as to whether we get back home or not. . . .

Now part of the reason why we do not have sufficient Priesthood bearers to save the Constitution, let alone to shake the powers of hell, is, I fear, because unlike Moroni, our souls do not joy in keeping our country free and we are not firm in the faith of Christ, nor have we sworn with an oath to defend our rights.

( Source: “Our Immediate Responsibility” 10-11; also in An Enemy Hath Done This 313-15 )

Harold B. Lee:

It was Joseph Smith who has been quoted as having said that the time would come when then Constitution would hang as by a thread, and at that time when it was thus in jeopardy, the elders of this Church would step forth and save it from destruction.

Why the elders of this Church? Would it be sacrilegious to paraphrase the words of the Apostle Peter, and say that the Constitution of the United States could be saved by the elders of this Church because this Church and this Church alone has the words of eternal life? We alone know by revelation as to how the Constitution came into being, and we, alone, know by revelation the destiny of this nation. The preservation of “life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness” can be guaranteed upon no other basis than upon a sincere faith and testimony of the divinity of these teachings.

( Source: “Faith – An Effective Weapon Against Wickedness in Men and Nations” 912-13 )

Joseph Fielding Smith:

The statement has been made that the Prophet [Joseph Smith] said the time would come when this Constitution would hang as by a thread, and this is true. There has been some confusion, however, as to just what he said following this. I think that Elder Orson Hyde has given us a correct interpretation wherein he says that the Prophet said the Constitution would be in danger… Now I tell you it is time the people of the United States were waking up with the understanding that if they don’t save the Constitution from the dangers that threaten it, we will have a change of government.

( Source: “Founded in the Wisdom of God” 416 )

Joseph F. Smith:

 Joseph Smith, the prophet, was inspired to affirm and ratify this truth, and he further predicted that the time would come, when the Constitution of our country would hang as it were by a thread, and that the Latter-day Saints above all other people in the world would come to the rescue of that great and glorious palladium of our liberty. We cannot brook the thought of it being torn into shreds, or destroyed, or trampled under foot and ignored by men. We cannot tolerate the sentiment, at one time expressed, by a man, high in authority in the nation. He said: “The Constitution be damned; the popular sentiment of the people is the Constitution!” That is the sentiment of anarchism that has spread to a certain extent, and is spreading over “the land of liberty and home of the brave.” We do not tolerate it. Latter-day Saints cannot tolerate such a spirit as this. It is anarchy. It means destruction. It is the spirit of mobocracy, and the Lord knows we have suffered enough from mobocracy, and we do not want any more of it. Our people from Mexico are suffering from the effects of that same spirit. We do not want any more of it, and we cannot afford to yield to that spirit or contribute to it in the least degree. We should stand with a front like flint against every spirit or species of contempt or disrespect for the Constitution of our country and the constitutional laws of our land.

( Source: “The Mexican Trouble – Loyalty to the Constitution” 101-02 )

Lorenzo Snow:

They will sustain the constitution and laws and institutions of the United States, and be the champions of liberty and of that constitution when its integrity shall be threatened.

( Source: Journal History of the Church, 15 Sep 1898, 3 )

Wilford Woodruff:

The Prophet Joseph Smith had said the time would come when the principles of the Constitution would be forsaken and that instrument would be rent asunder, and this people would then step forward and rescue it from entire destruction.

( Source: Journal History of the Church, 6 Apr 1882, 3 )

John Taylor:

It may not be among the improbabilities, that the prophecies of Joseph Smith may be fulfilled and that the calumniated and despised Mormons may yet become the protectors of the Constitution and the guardians of religious liberty and human freedom in these United States.

( Source: Journal of Discourses 23:266 )

Need we be surprised that they should trample under foot the Constitution of the United States? No; Joseph Smith told us that they would do it. Many around me here knew long ago that they would do this thing and further knew that the last people that should be found to rally around the sacred instrument and save it from the grasp of unrighteous men would be the Elders of Israel! When, therefore, we see these things progressing need we be astonished? I do not think we need be.

( Source: Journal of Discourses 20:318 )

Brigham Young:

Every organization of our government, the best government in the world, is crumbling to pieces. Those who have it in their hands are the ones who are destroying it. How long will it be before the words of the prophet Joseph will be fulfilled? He said if the Constitution of the United States were saved at all it must be done by this people. It will not be many years before these words come to pass.

( Source: Journal of Discourses 12:204 )

Others Quoting What They Heard Joseph Smith Say…

Eliza R. Snow:

I heard the prophet Joseph Smith say… that the time would come when this nation would so far depart from its original purity, its glory, and its love for freedom and its protection of civil rights and religious rights, that the Constitution of our country would hang as it were by a thread. He said, also, that this people, the sons of Zion, would rise up and save the Constitution and bear it off triumphantly.

( Source: Eliza R. Snow 556 )

Orson Hyde:

I believe he [Joseph Smith] said something like this – that the time would come when the Constitution and the country would be in danger of an overthrow; and said he, If the Constitution be saved at all, it will be by the Elders of this Church. I believe this is about the language, as nearly as I can recollect it.

( Source: Journal of Discourses 6:152 – quoted by Orson Hyde )

Jedediah M. Grant:

We are friendly to our country, and when we speak of the flag of our Union, we love it, and we love the rights the Constitution guarantees to every citizen. What did the Prophet Joseph say? When the Constitution shall be tottering we shall be the people to save it from the hand of the foe.

( Source: Tyler 350 – quoted by Jedediah M. Grant )

James Burgess:

…Joseph Smith made some remarks upon our condition as a people and upon our future prospects contrasting our present condition with our past trials and persecutions by the hands of our enemies. Also upon the constitution and government of the United States stating that the time would come when the Constitution and Government would hand [sic] by a brittle thread and would be ready to fall into other hands but this people the Latter-day Saints will step forth and save it.

( Source: The Words of Joseph Smith 279 )

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38 Responses to “The Constitution Hanging by a Thread and the “White Horse Prophecy””

  1. mekarie Says:

    I really appreciate this article! It was well researched, commented upon, and you let those who really knew the prophet Joseph Smith make their own comments. Thank you for this inspiring article. I hope you don’t mind but I shared a line from President Benson on Facebook. I also really enjoy your website and am glad to find good men and women who are waking up to our situation in this country. WE will make the difference. Thank you for those 4 steps too, I will be passing them on.

  2. Maria Bird Says:

    I think that not only our Constitution is hanging on a thread, but the whole world. This is going to be the last battle between Jesus (Love) and Lucifer (Hate). Love is the essence of the Kingdom of Heaven and nobody will enter it, if we do not understand that love is eternal life and hate will never prevail.
    Our memories are very, very short. How many civilizations have gone awry because the lack of love and been eliminated from the face of the earth? Did reaches of any kind safe anyone from death?. We should study our past to make a better world by following the Gospel of Jesus Christ that will keep us from corruption. To love our brothers with charity, because what is charity but love in action?

  3. Phil Smith Says:

    Excellent article, and great comments! It is true that living the gospel of love will eliminate much of the difficulties in life but love not always seems to affect the hardened hearts of the wicked (i.e. uninspired). We as Latter-day Saints have been given the command to “come out of Babylon” and be “independent of the world” yet we have freely chosen to disregard these directives. Is there any wonder why we have not established Zion as yet? I do not believe we can save a constitution or its principles unless we embrace those principles ourselves. Sadly, we want our cake and eat it too so we speak of freedom, we teach of freedom and we even pray for freedom, yet we vote for socialistic handouts, both great and small… that is our stumbling block. Once we learn to apply proper principles to ourselves we will begin to have our eyes opened.

  4. G. Michael Craig Says:

    I had very mixed feelings while reading this. On the one hand, it is wonderful to know that I am not alone in my efforts to defend freedom, and the principles of agency, liberty, contained within the Constitution. On the other hand, I thought of all the persecution that I and our children have been subjected to from active LDS over the years because of our commitment to these sacred things. And seeing that our most prominent LDS politicians, Romney, Huntsman, and especially Reid(The Weasel) are all socialists is an even greater source of consternation and sadness. Well did Presidents J. Reuben Clark and Ezra Taft Benson speak when they warned us about increasing numbers of these “ravening wolves” in leadership positions who were increasingly teaching us “the precepts of men” that the Lord warned us about in 2nd Nephi 28:14. These days, repeating these warnings at Church is the quickest way to get yourself ostracized, released from your callings, and stripped of your temple recommend. Been there, done that. Very sad.

  5. John Says:

    While teaching in High Priests today I made the statement that the constitution was inspired, should be treated like scripture and that is should be used as a guide-post for making decisions about how we vote on candidates and issues! most of the class disagreed with me!

  6. Ben Arnold Says:

    Excellent work, thank you so very much! Solved all of my questions immediately. I was very curious, you laid it all out, and then just as I was asking -well is it true or not?!- that’s when you pulled out the quotes of prophets with whose voice I will never argue or vary, and then you further went on to say what they DO believe which as I know for fact will happen if a prophet of the Lord says it. So God bless you. Thank you very much. I love and follow your work. Brother BEN :0)

  7. Jared Held Says:

    Who makes the connection of the Constitution hanging by a thread and the “White Horse Prophecy?”
    Is there any connection other then the writer here who said it comes to mind of it when a reference is made of the “Hang by a Thread Prophecy?”

  8. LDS Conservative Says:

    There is a very obvious connection. If you read the “white horse prophecy” quoted above you would have read the following within it:

    “You will see the Constitution of the United States almost destroyed. It will hang like a thread as fine as a silk fiber…”

  9. Jay Says:

    I get similar reactions from church members here in Australia there he goes talking politics or the old classic just live the gospel and don’t worry about the rest but I am comforted to know that there are saints who take the matter of liberty and upholding the inspired constitution seriously. We must continue to educate ourselves on these crucial issues of eternal significance follow the prophet and exercise personal righteousness in all we do. Thank you for this website.

  10. Roger Hunt Says:

    excellant article,,and one not popular with many “modern Mormons” who just want to stick their heads in the sand and say “all is well in Zion”. How can the Church save the constitution when liberals have made such inroads into the Church? The answer: It won’t be the Church,,,rather the MEMBERS of the Church,,more specifically the members who still love that sacred document.
    Keep up the good work,,I just found your site and am in support of what you are trying to do.

  11. jbh Says:

    Great article and thanks for the information and quotes. This is an excellent resource for information on the white horse prophecy. I had no idea there was so much to back up the constitution hanging by a thread statement; I’d been told it was false and made up but never bothered to actually research it until now. Thanks!

    By the way, it’s “Elders” not “Elder’s”… ;)

  12. LDS Conservative Says:

    Thanks.
    There are more quotes I could have included but didn’t to keep it as short as possible while still getting the point across.

  13. CONSTITUTION HANGS BY A THREAD « Moral Agency Says:

    [...] The Constitution Hanging by a Thread and the “White Horse Prophecy”  There are a lot of statements on freedom and the Constitution by the Presidents of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Many of these quotes include reference to the Constitution “hanging by a thread“, the “nation… on the very verge of crumbling to pieces”, “the constitution… upon the brink of ruin” and the Elders of Israel stepping up to save the Constitution. [...]

  14. Clint Says:

    Very helpful. For a additional insight into such an important topic I would refer any student to Ezra Taft Benson’s book “An Enemy Hath Done This.” You will be pleased you picked it up.

  15. Mike Says:

    I appreciate the research and information presented here very much, since this is a topic I was just recently wondering about. However in some of the above comments I caught a certain attitude that concerns me. There is a sort of “us and them” flavor that tends to divide us apart from others who may not agree with us about our politics. I love the constitution and agree 100% that it needs to be studied and better understood, also that we as members of the church have a solemn obligation to uphold this inspired document, but if we by any kind of antagonism separate from those who don’t see this importance we divide the body of Christ and cut ourselves off from the chance to bring others to an understanding of these important topics. Remember that the church will not fail-this is prophesied. The church has no official political stand, and so this is likely why people are uncomfortable when such things are brought up in Sunday school. Lets always be understanding of differences in political beliefs, but never compromise our moral standards. Remember, not all liberals are liberals because they agree with abortion and gay marriage. Sometimes it is just hard to find a good candidate you totally can endorse, on either side of the aisle!

  16. Romney and the Morman plan for America - US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum Says:

    [...] [...]

  17. LDS Conservative Says:

    @Mike, I think you bring up some good points in your comment.
    One thing I want to point out is that while the Church doesn’t have an “official political stand”, the Gospel contains a clearly defined set of principles including principles relating to the Agency, Freedom, Liberty and the proper role of government, and therefore through learning those principles, and seeking the guidance of the Lord, we can align ourselves politically with those that support these same principles. It truly is hard to find a good candidate to totally endorse, and unfortunately both major political parties in the US are promoting principles contrary to the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

    Also unfortunate is the fact that even when discussing correct principles with other Church members many are still going to be ‘uncomfortable’ – but that’s okay, let’s do our best to approach these differences as guided by the Spirit and in a christ-like manner. Line upon line, precept upon precept.

  18. ker Says:

    According to a researcher for the church who has studied the “White Horse Prophecy” about 80 percent of the statements in this prophecy have come to pass. The opinions of those past leaders would probably change their minds if they saw what was and is happening now. WE need to get our own witness from God of what we need to do personally to stand by and defend our heavenly banner, the Constitution.

  19. Sam Says:

    Thank you for your articles, this one in particular highlights to me a nation walking further and further from the things that make it great. I live in such a country… and while I count the blessings I have here in England I recall the words of Dallen H Oaks to our mission in Manchester, That England is on the path to hell. This is not so alarming to hear when you see the popular culture that pervades our society. The future lies with us now and calls for greater efforts to understand the world around us. Realise the things that make us great and understand the things that threaten all that is good. I am sad to say that there is a general ignorance to such things in England, education is the key. You are doing a brilliant job of this as it is such a sensitive and contemporary issue. It calls for great attention and diplomatic administration. I love the gospel, I love my saviour and I know this world is full of good people who want to do good. This fills me with hope :)

  20. Curious Bob Says:

    While I appreciate the research presented here, the one thing that worries me is that the image of the man on the white horse (which is sold as a pin, yes?) appears to have Mitt Romney’s face.

  21. Jonathan Says:

    It is interesting to observe that many of the quotes listed here that indicate that the constitution is already falling apart are more than 100 years old already. This means that the constitution has been falling apart for more than 100 years. If nothing else, this proves the strength of the document. Yet at the same time it also indicates how dire is the need for the Constitution to be saved.

  22. Robert D Gorgoglione Says:

    G. Michael Craig: These days, repeating these warnings at Church is the quickest way to get yourself ostracized, released from your callings, and stripped of your temple recommend. Been there, done that. Very sad.

    Exactly the same thing happened to me and my family in Connecticut. There truly are ravening wolves amongst the flock, but the Church is True.

    Joseph’s greatest persecutions came as a results of apostates that at times literally surrounded him. Five of the Quorum of the Twelve along with one of his counselors conspired to have him removed and murdered.

    Since my wife and I moved to Idaho Falls nearly 4 years ago, we and our “controversial” views have been well received. The Saints in this area are much more tolerant and loving than back east. Maybe you should prayerfully consider moving up here to Idaho Falls.

    There are many LDS patriots in this area. The recent Ron Paul campaign rally in Idaho Falls was jam packed with standing room only.

    Your Brother in Christ
    Robert D. Gorgoglione Sr.
    In the tradition of Patrick Henry & Thomas Jefferson

    P.S.
    The only way they will get rid of me is if they all leave the church and I am left alone with the Prophet !!!

  23. Laurie Says:

    The members in my own Stake/Branch seem to have an aversion to even discussing current events, the Constitution, or anything remotely connected with “politics”. They wrongly interpret “separation of church and state” to mean religious people aren’t allowed to discuss politics! It is very frustrating to see so many unwilling to even listen to my concerns about how seriously the Constitution is being dismantled and ignored, and how close we are to becoming a people stripped of our basic god-given rights. They practically cover their ears and walk way screaming, ” That’s just a conspiracy theory!”. I wonder to myself if they have ever read the Book of Mormon or the words of our latter-day prophets. It is comforting to find your website and hear there are actually some of us latter-day saints aware and trying to remain vigilant in preserving our freedoms and our Constitutional protections from enemies both foreign and DOMESTIC (those who would destroy the U.S. from within our government). I, too, support Ron Paul for president and pray sincerely that we can get him elected. Listening to his words are like hearing quotes form our prophets….he is trying to save us and our Constitution. Uninformed members seem to automatically support Romney…ignoring his record and his generalized soundbites with no “fruit” to back his words.

  24. Renny Says:

    I was in an Elders quorum meeting recently in my Salt Lake ward and I too felt ostracized when I commented on how the Constitution is under attack. It’s shocking to see that members really do not want to talk about it – in the very church that tells us it was given to us by our Lord. It’s like if they ignore the problem then it’s “not really a problem” syndrome. I too am a Ron Paul supporter because he really does care about saving the Constitution like no other politician in recent history. Romney supports the new NDAA which now gives the government the “right” to call upon the military to act as civilian police and detain any American citizen indefinitely without reason or trial by jury. I don’t know how many Constitutional rights this circumvents (like the 4th Ammendment for beginners, and others) but it also violates Posse Comitatus which was a law created during the Reconstruction era after the Civil War. During this time the military was over using their power to arrest citizens and Posse Comitatus stated that only civilian police could conduct arrests, etc. Even now the government has officially stated that they take marching orders for our own military from the United Nations, and NOT Congress! The days of the Constitution’s near destruction is not in the near future any longer, but is NOW in our very day. And I’m convinced that parts of the secret combination societies not only reside in our government, but mainstream corporate media giants that have told us from the beginning that Ron Paul is “not electable.” How would they know something like that so early on in the presidential campaigns season? It is because Ron Paul stands for the Constitution like no other that they do not want him to win? Now there are a multitude of campaign voter fraud stories surfacing that Ron Paul has had a lot of states taken from him – all anyone needs to do is YouTube “campaign voter fraud” and it’s froth with stories of Ron Paul being victimized – you won’t typically see these stories on mainstream channels. This is the power of the media, that they black out Ron Paul success stories (has thousands attend his speeches in every state) but only highlight speeches given by others who typically have smaller attendance rates. I participated in Utah’s recent caucus in my district. I was told, mostly by LDS folks, that Ron Paul cannot win so they are voting for Mitt Romney even though he does not support the Constitution as much. It was so obvious to me how the majority of people can be swayed by the media. I ask people to vote their conscience and be right with God. This is not to say that local media people are evil. But they can only report the stories handed to them by the higher ups in the corporation or they lose their jobs. This is how they program “opinions” into innocent American citizens across the country. Many Americans are waking up and turning to alternative website based news agencies like INFOWARS dot com or NATURALNEWS dot com and many many others, because they do not have the corporate influence in providing biased stories for their political gain. I served in military during Desert Storm 1 and served my church on a full-time mission. I took an oath to defend the Constitution both foreign and DOMESTIC. It is true in history that almost always, the greatest countries in history were brought down from within. This is why the founding fathers included the word DOMESTIC and I believe this is where we need to take our stand in protecting the Constitution. The current administration is facing impeachment hearing by Congress but there is a TOTAL media blackout on this story. The establishment media is biased and trying to protect the current administration from any type of negative publicity by ignoring the impeachment hearing and ignoring how the administration has signed laws (NDAA) that directly discredit the Constitution of the United States. We have to help educate our LDS neighbors and friends how we are under sneak attack and to WAKE UP before all of our rights are gone. It’s sad to use this analogy but it was too late for the Jews to complain when they were being marched into the ovens. I can’t imagine how horrible that must have been – that it actually came to that for these unfortunate people! Let’s not wait till our “last day” because it will be too late for us as well. “Stand up for something now or you will fall for anything later” is a quote that bears true meaning.

  25. Bryan Says:

    I know that Ron Paul has some very pro-Constitution views but certain things he espouses scare me. He is in favor of doing away with laws that regulate, for example, prostitution and drug use. To me, anyone who espouses such things is not a conservative. I’m aware of the economic reasoning behind relaxing such things but I’m also conscious of the main message of the Book of Mormon that this nation was built and must stand upon righteous principles. People base their behavior on laws and once these “moral” laws are relaxed, people tend to think, “Hmm, this behavior must be OK now that there’s no laws against it.” Witness the proliferation of foul language used freely in schools since movies use it freely and courts have said it’s OK. Also, many references in the Book of Mormon indicate that they had laws against murder and stealing, as well as adultery. You could well extrapolate the “and all things like unto it” phrase from Doctrine and Covenants for our day.

    Glenn Beck often expresses the fact that while libertarianism has good premises, it can only be practiced successfully when people’s hearts are in the right place, and I agree with that. During the Millennium when the Savior reigns and His government is in place, laws will still exist against evil but of course enforcing them won’t be as much of a problem since the population will consist of those who desire to do right.

    The above reasons lead me to think that Ron Paul and what he stands for would be a bad choice, regardless of the correct things he believes about the Constitution. Why does he have a strong following of youthful supporters who don’t appear to be conservative? I worked with a young man with at least one DUI conviction and was seen by a fellow employee pouring alcohol into a “water bottle” that he carried onto the work floor; and who was later canned because of dishonest behavior. He supported Ron Paul because to him liberty as promoted by Paul meant relaxation of constraints. Not saying that all youth supporting Congressman Paul are this way, but this instance opened my eyes that it’s a huge possibility that most are.

  26. Bret Says:

    This was a very nice article, and the White Horse prophecy would not be too far off the dream of John Taylor, when he saw the destruction via a train ride, whether in or out he did not confirm, that is the train.
    You will lose your recommend and not be found in favor when you state these types of messages. The gospel will always be true, the members seem to want to remain happy socialists. As long as they can point the finger elsewhere, keep their status and their recommends, all is well in Zion for them.
    Furthermore it is not just enough to speak the message but walk that same way as well, otherwise we become exactly like what we talk about when speaking of the people who trample the Constitution under their feet, which would include Romney.
    A march back to the Constitution in a straight line as Dr. Paul describes along with many of the Prophets is the only way we can preserve this country from the Revolution that comes, but I think socialism is here to stay and many members are full embraced in it. The Constitution requires constant vigilance where Socialism allows ease.
    Never think that when you share the truth, many among your wards and branches will take the truth to be hard, it never has or ever will be popular, but that is the lot you have drawn by learning and embracing it.
    Let freedom ring, and as importantly let us who learn do the ringing.

  27. Andrew Says:

    I believe in these prophecies, but I think we tend to be too myopic when considering how they may be fulfilled, and how often they are fulfilled. I think the Constitution has had many challenges over the years — the Civil War being the greatest and most direct threat, and future to the time when Joseph Smith spoke about this issue. Recently it’s been en vogue for certain Governors to dance around the issue of whether or not their states would leave the Union, as if such talk was not a direct attack on the Constitution. How about Jack Anderson, for instance? His reporting helped shed light on various nefarious schemes that, in one way or another, attacked the Constitution. In a similar vein Harry Reid and the Democrats in Congress finally did something about the crazy overreach of the Bush administration after the 2004 election. By that time a lot had already been compromised (I’m no fan of the NDAA), but it could have been much, much worse if someone didn’t step in.

  28. Nephi Young Says:

    I was liking this then I saw the churches website http://www.mormontopics.org/eng/politics

    And it is very specific that the church, meaning heavenly father doesn’t want politics talked about at church. So as much as this saddens me I will be obedient. I know it is to teach me humility.

  29. Warren jay Gleason Says:

    The things that are very evidenced to me is that other governments are dividing up this land of America for themselves. Our electric power companies are being sold to foreign interests, our oil resources are being controlled by outside people. I understand a large part of western Colorado is owned or controlled by Germany and a part of Idaho belongs to the homeland of shell oil company and china has and is in the process of controlling our California and Oregon wind generators. Scottish power has in past owned Utah and pacific power and paid millions in bribes. The list goes on and on.

  30. Benjamin Says:

    @Bret

    To be fair, I admire a great deal of the principles Ron Paul stands for, and while I don’t agree entirely with him, at least when he goes to the point of heavily blaming America, when the situation is more complex than what he really offers. However, I do feel it’s more important to discuss the actual principles more than those who espouse it.

    Is it right that we should have authorized targeted killings of alleged “foreign enemies” of the U.S. in their own lands? Is it right that we should have foreign wars in which victory is not clearly defined? Is it even right that we should go off and invade foreign countries to “avenge” the wrongs done to our country, like 9/11? Is foreign aid and praise to sketchy national leaders like the situation in the Middle East great either? Is it alright that

    The big picture, however, is that the whole bipartisan system has its massive share of corruption and flaws, in short it demonstrates a lack of trust in the fact that there really is divine power conditionally protecting America, and that while awful things can happen, and while effort would inevitably be neccessary, it would be a better place if one really trusted the fact that God himself could ensure America’s success and prosperity, and not surveillance, not counterfeits.

    Returning to Ron Paul, the man isn’t perfect, but what’s more important is recognizing the real constitutional principles, not the imperfect people who advocate them.

  31. Rex Says:

    The Constitution might endure, but I’m not so sure about this country. Consider D&C 87:6 “And thus, with the sword and by bloodshed the inhabitants of the earth shall mourn; and with famine, and plague, and earthquake, and the thunder of heaven, and the fierce and vivid lightning also, shall the inhabitants of the earth be made to feel the wrath, and indignation, and chastening hand of an Almighty God, until the consumption decreed hath made a full end of ALL nations;” [my emphasis].

    As for there being a physical gathering to “Zion” for safety, consider D&C 45:68–69, regarding the establishment of the New Jerusalem: “And it shall come to pass among the wicked, that every man that will not take his sword against his neighbor must needs flee unto Zion for safety. And there shall be gathered unto it out of every nation under heaven; and it shall be the only people that shall not be at war one with another.” This does not sound like the spiritual gathering that is going on now.

    Let us also remember what Moroni said about secret combinations in our day in Ether 8: 22–25:
    22 And whatsoever nation shall uphold such secret combinations, to get power and gain, until they shall spread over the nation, behold, they shall be destroyed; for the Lord will not suffer that the blood of his saints, which shall be shed by them, shall always cry unto him from the ground for vengeance upon them and yet he avenge them not.
    23 Wherefore, O ye Gentiles, it is wisdom in God that these things should be shown unto you, that thereby ye may repent of your sins, and suffer not that these murderous combinations shall get above you, which are built up to get power and gain—and the work, yea, even the work of destruction come upon you, yea, even the sword of the justice of the Eternal God shall fall upon you, to your overthrow and destruction if ye shall suffer these things to be.
    24 Wherefore, the Lord commandeth you, when ye shall see these things come among you that ye shall awake to a sense of your awful situation, because of THIS [my emphasis] secret combination which shall be among you; or wo be unto it, because of the blood of them who have been slain; for they cry from the dust for vengeance upon it, and also upon those who built it up.
    25 For it cometh to pass that whoso buildeth it up seeketh to overthrow the freedom of all lands, nations, and countries; and it bringeth to pass the destruction of all people, for it is built up by the devil, who is the father of all lies;”

    Notice that he starts out talking about secret combinations in general, but in v. 24 he refers to one in particular. Although this secret combination might generically be referred to as the church of the devil, it must have an organization about it. What that is, I don’t know for sure, but I am suspicious of people and organizations that promote the idea of overthrowing “the freedom of all lands, nations, and countries.” It also sounds like the saints are going to be persecuted and their blood shed, at some time in our future.

  32. Rex Says:

    Bryan,
    First of all, the last thing Ron Paul would want to be accused of is being a “conservative,” especially when we see what “conservatism” stands for nowadays. What Ron Paul believes in is personal responsibility and freedom of choice and being held accountable for being irresponsible or making wrong choices. Above all, he does not believe that the federal government has any authority to regulate personal behavior. If any entity does, it would be the states, counties, and municipalities. So just because federal drug and prostitution laws might be repealed does not mean that there would be no laws against them – just not federal ones. Besides, as despicable as you might think prostitution and drugs are, who gets to decide what other things (such as plural marriage, for example) should be regulated? It becomes a slippery slope. Imagine what the outcome of the war in heaven would have been had Heavenly Father regulated his children’s choices. He, in effect, would have become evil, for that is what Lucifer wanted to do – force everyone to be good. Rather than interfere with his children’s agency, he allowed 1/3 of them to be held accountable for their choice and be lost. I, for one, am sick to death of government regulation and am willing to give freedom a chance. Of course, with that freedom would come the accompanying penalties for violating other persons or their property. It is embarrassing that Ron Paul should have to set the example for “Latter-day Saints” like Hatch, Romney, and Reid, who, of all in Congress, should have a solid understanding of the Constitution and want to defend it.

  33. Jesse Says:

    In spite of numerous scriptural and prophetic invitations to “flee Babylon” and “establish Zion”, the typical Mormon has no understanding of the difference between the two or how to recognize either. The vast majority of us ignorantly work each and every day to build Babylon in spite of the fact that we’ve covenanted to build Zion.
    I recently completed a study of those very issues and charted it all out. What dawned on me while pondering the two pathways was that unless and until we Americans repent en masse and seek to understand _and live by_ God’s wisdom (aka humility) instead of our own (aka pride), this nation is on a certain path to self-destruction. And the ONLY other way out I’m aware of is being humbled via a God-invoked catastrophe – like Nephi using famine to get the Nephites to stop killing each other. Harsh reality.
    I think I’d prefer we humble ourselves, but if not, I’d prefer our being humbled by God than by a tyrant. How about you?

  34. Believe All Things Says:

    Thanks for writing this Brian. There is a lot of misinformation concerning this subject. Earlier this year KSL had a guest who was unaware of Joseph Smith’s other statements and concluded that because this quote is often conflated with the White Horse Prophecy, that Joseph Smith in fact did not make this statement.

    Now that some are advocating “a change in government” (Georgetown Law Center professor Louis Michael Seidman NY Times article “Let’s Give Up on the Constitution”), past statements by LDS prophets and apostles about the constitution continue to be fulfilled.

  35. Charles Miller Says:

    Glory to God; how grateful I am for the gospel of Jesus Christ, the promptings of the Holy Ghost and the Light of Christ (conscience). I am so grateful for truth and light for inspired teachings such as this that lead me closer to God each time I participate in freedom and liberty under God.

    I know the White Horse Prophecy is not endorsed revelation, but I can see threads of truth through the witnesses (who were not perfect men), citing through memory words from Joseph Smith that have validity today.

    I respect and see the spiritual wisdom in Pres. Joseph F. Smith and Elder Bruce McConkie’s statements as well. I feel deeply that this is a case where we must take the Holy Spirit as our guide and stand independent in our testimonies of God (rather than living on borrowed light) while following the prophetic voices of our day, and by following the light and truth of the gospel. Controversy and speculation is not what’s important, it is truth, and it should be everything to us.

  36. Robert Says:

    In years past I spent some time researching this as history is an interest of mine. The White horse /Red Horse prophecy as presented is not accurate and has been denounced by church leaders. However there are some threads of truth within the prophecy, i.e. the Constitution hanging by a thread.

    The key thing to understand about this and many other quotes, letters, and documents in Church History is just because something has some threads of truth contained within it doesn’t mean that the entire message or document is true, accurate, or revelation from on high.

    Consider this statement that was approved by the First Presidency and put on the church web site:

    “Not every statement made by a Church leader, past or present, necessarily constitutes doctrine. A single statement made by a single leader on a single occasion often represents a personal, though well-considered, opinion, but is not meant to be officially binding for the whole Church. With divine inspiration, the First Presidency…and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles…counsel together to establish doctrine that is consistently proclaimed in official Church publications. This doctrine resides in the four “standard works” of scripture (the Holy Bible, the Book of Mormon, the Doctrine and Covenants and the Pearl of Great Price), official declarations and proclamations, and the Articles of Faith. Isolated statements are often taken out of context, leaving their original meaning distorted. ”
    —LDS Newsroom, “Approaching Mormon Doctrine,” lds.org (4 May 2007) off-site]

    I recall around 2007 – 2009 Boyd K. Packer gave a talk in his home ward. Some well meaning individual made “notes” of the talk. Not an exact transcript or even close mind you but notes. Some one else took the notes, converted the notes to something that looked like a talk, then passed it along to some one on the internet via email. Once that went out, it was spread far and wide (splattered around) and people would gullibly get the purported Packer talk, and buy into it hook line and sinker. Packer finally issued a statement that the “words” in this PDF were not his words and was his personal opinion. Further if you wanted his message to the entire world go to the October conference talk and throw the PDF away.

    Another one attributed to Packer and other members of the First Presidency and the Twelve began with ‘The youth of the Church today were generals in the war in heaven,’ and ends with the statement that when they return to heaven ‘all in attendance will bow in your presence.’
    This was widely spread around the Church in the 90s and early 2000s but Packer indicated that “I did not make that statement. I do not believe that statement.” Further that none of the Brethren had made the statement.
    When this statement was circulating, people thought this was some kind of revelation, to be taken to heart when in fact it was not truth and not accurate.

    Years ago (90s) in my Stake the “Mormon Hitchhiker” story circulated. For those who don’t know this tale, the very abbreviated version of this story is that a person is driving along the freeway and sees a hitch hiker, stops and picks them up. As they are driving the hitch hiker tells them to get their food storage because the end of America is close, or bad times are coming, or a giant earth quake will strike Utah etc etc. Then the hitch hiker vanishes out of the car, while the car is moving at speed limit. When I heard it, a friend of mine described the story, said it had actually happened to a friend of theirs while they were driving between Brigham City and Ogden.

    I was intrigued by the story, however have always believed the Reagan quote of trust but verify. So I went to the person it allegedly happened to and asked about it. Turns out it didn’t happen to them, but somebody they knew. As I recall a brother. When I checked with the brother it didn’t happen to him but it was somebody else. What I found out after I dug about 20 people deep on the story and still never found the original person that this actually happened to, is good people heard an incredible story. Instantly they wanted to breathlessly tell somebody else. When they retold it, many retold it in the first person (that it happened to them) as they unloaded to somebody else. Some accurately said that they had heard it from the person they heard it from.

    At once stake conference I was taking notes and so were many others. One speaker gave an incredible message and I asked that person for a copy of the talk for myself. Thinking about this I wondered what the notes of people in the audience that I knew would show about what this speaker said. I can tell you that the notes ranged from not even close to somewhat close but not exactly. The point is that unless we have an exact transcript of the talk given, which the speaker had a chance to review if something had changed i.e. the spirit adds something, we are dealing with information that may not be accurate or represents one individuals opinion based upon what he or she heard or thought they heard. This is true of historical documents, diaries and many other things written by individuals in church history.

    At the personal level consider if a husband and wife who each keep a diary, write about a particular event, anything from a major crises, to a vacation. If read together by an outsider, you would very likely find that the diary accounts don’t match and that particular areas of the event struck each participant in a different manner, which led them to write things about the event differently and come to different conclusions about what they thought and understood was going on. Not saying that either of them was wrong, just hit them different and they described it differently. Better yet, lets say that an event is recalled that happened 10 years previous to when they wrote it. They wrote the account to the best of their memory, 10 years later. I would say that some of it would be accurate, there would be some elements of truth and their would be information that was not accurate.

    Say somebody were to go through said diaries 20 years or 100 years after the fact, to try to come up with a historical conclusion as to what actually happened. It may or may not be completely and totally historically accurate. It may be that person’s feelings, thoughts, or how their mind interpreted the event. The diary entry may even be of an event that did not happen when they wrote it but years earlier.

    Point is that we should not assume that information like this is “absolute gospel”, “First Presidency approved”, ” never doubt it” “direct revelation from God.”

    I knew a Stake President and Bishop, who from outward appearances took copious notes at every meeting they attended. I asked them about it one day and they both gave me pretty much the same answer. They weren’t necessarily taking notes about what the speakers were saying, they were listening for and writing down the impressions of the spirit while the speaker was talking. Much of the time that had nothing to do with the speaker or speakers message, but it had a lot to do with them, their families, their steward ship and their callings.

    While we are in our church meetings, we can be really close to the spirit if we are ready and prepared. What the spirit whispers to us as individuals is not meant for the church as a whole or perhaps even to other family members. It is only meant for us personally, or those in our stewardship. It is not to be put out on the internet, or spread far and wide.

  37. Guy S Says:

    I really appreciate this article. I am astounded by the ignorance of so many concerning Mormon Doctrine, Prophecy and The Constitution. We are told in the scriptures is was given by divine inspiration to the Founding Fathers, dictated to them by the Lord to set up a free nation where his Gospel could be restored and sent forth the rest of the world in purity. We are told to study the Constitution, the Declaration of Independence and Bill of Rights. We are told to become familiar with and understand the workings of government and the issues and events taking place around us. Yet so many members of the church don’t want to hear it, talk about it, understand it and almost seem to fear doing so. I was asked to speak in sacrament meeting on the Constitution and words of the prophets concerning it. I prepared a carefully worded talk, making certain there were no allusions to any political party or politician, speaking only of the Principles of Liberty and those who work to destroy it in our day as prophesied in the Book of Mormon. About 2/3rds of the way into the talk, I was cut short by a member of the bishopric, telling me I needed to end it so a member of the high council could speak. Understand, I was given an allotted time and was well within it when cut short. The high councilman then stood up and spoke about some other subject with no relevance to the subject matter given to the speakers on July 4th. I am still amazed when I think on it. I have often felt maybe I was the only one who felt like a majority of church members have their heads buried in the sand. I was grateful to hear some of the other responses on this page from church members all over the world who are experiencing the same thing, that I was not alone in that sentiment, or that it was a figment of my imagination. Truly, Satan is raging in the earth, and will do all he can to deceive even the very elect, even members of the church who should know better and have been forewarned on countless occasions. Many have ears but are deaf, and eyes but are blinded by the cunning plan of evil men to distract and distort in order to deceive. Again, thank you for the great article and for speaking out. We need thousands more like you.

  38. Is The Constitution Worth Protecting? | lennyblogs Says:

    […] The Constitution Hanging by a Thread and the “White Horse Prophecy” Did Joseph Smith really say the Constitution would be hanging by a thread, the nation would be on the verge of crumbling to pieces and the Elder’s of Israel would save the Constitution? […]

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